DescentBB

Xfing

Oh, you're probably right about that one. I remember the D1 boss always taking forever to kill, even though he's "only" 3k ahead of the first boss. Yet the length of taking them down seems to be worlds apart.

Well, how about just the resistance and armament changes, then?

Xfing

Yeah, the difference between D1 and D2 is that in D1 you'll die instantly, while in D2 you'll die anyway :lol: As for cool robot combos... lemme think. As far as aesthetics go: Class 2 Drone + Logikill Boarshead + Class 1 Heavy Driller Small Hulk + Lou Guard + Green Platrformer (Ouch.) MAX + Super H...

Xfing

I think it's a fair change, considering it also gives the player a bit of a breather between the Alien 2 Boss and the Red Guard. The Red Guard just deserves to be the final boss, IMO (and I definitely had a harder time with it than the Alien 2 Boss normally), but I also think it's better to give th...

Xfing

As for robot balance, Vertigo still obviously favored its own and D2 bots. The D1 bots were mostly treated as guest appearances, one (or two at most) per level. In order to truly balance out the robots, one would have to pool all of them together and place them according to difficulty - not looking ...

Xfing

But other than that I'm satisfied with the boss order. So what do you say we simply swap the D1 Final Boss and the Red Guard? That'll make the final challenge greater. And we'll need to make sure that the final level's boss arena is smaller and provides less cover than the one from Vertigo. The fina...

Xfing

It would appear that these were indeed planets. Probably orphan ones, though I'm not sure.

Xfing

I always thought it was more of an oily black than an obsidian black, but I noticed that too. I've used it more as an overlay for lava than a rock texture on its own, but I agree that it really gives the levels more of a sense of diversity in environment that goes above and beyond Counterstrike. Ot...

Xfing

To say something on topic: Recently, I've played through Vertigo once more, and couldn't help noticing one thing: Vertigo's in LOVE with the black obsidian texture. It's used probably in every single level of the pack. And these levels really do show what a versatile texture that is. Its only proble...

Xfing

500 hp per boss is not a great difference, especially seeing that there'll likely be many invulnerabilities to take advantage of. I have also noticed that bosses gain in durability on higher difficulties (though the D1 final boss always seems to take forever to go down, and for good reason). I don't...

Xfing

Luring platformers... Hell yeah, that's what I gotta try.

The first area is frustrating as hell, though. It really does take immense patience.

Xfing

This is the weirdest level I've ever played... what the hell have you done with all the robots? The gameplay's actually frustrating with all those modifications and extreme hp of the robots... As for the layout, it's alright, if a little plain.

Xfing

Actually, the D1,5 name comes from the fact that the mission will completely amalgamate D1 and D2 content... I suppose something less pretentious should be come up with as the final title

And as for the robot briefings, that's something to worry about later. Dozens of levels still to make.

Xfing

no, no.. what do you mean by "both kinds"? of what? aexit sequence WITH the secret level exit/entrance? No, I mean that we want to include both secret levels accessed by teleporters and by alternate exits. In D2 it's not physically possible to create alternate exits per se, but it is poss...

Xfing

I'd happily participate but I don't really have all that much free time, plus any level design work I do will go towards D1,5. Well still I wish you luck in gathering participants

Xfing

Not currently. Is this Descent 1.5 thing a D2 mission? A mod on D1? Any code changes? Last two would make it possible to do this. D2 Vertigo mission with restored D1 content, tweaked descent2.ham and descent2.s11 and .s22 files and an additional .PIG palette currently worked on by Pumo. You can rea...

Xfing

Sooo you mean it isn't possible to include any D1 robot in a robot briefing for a D2 mission?

What a bummer.

Xfing

Alright, I think I'll heed more experienced people then. Just make sure that when making proposals, every next boss is more difficult than the previous one. This might be tricky as hell to judge, though.

Xfing

Ok, thanks a bunch. I'll give it my best to obey this advice, heh heh.

Damn, level 20 is just too hard. Descent 1 overall is quite frustrating. Guess that's part of what made retro games so good, completing them alone was quite an achievement. Unlike today.

Xfing

I agree about the D1 final boss, he can be face-shakered and go down quite fast. Still, I think it would take around 7 Shakers to finish the job. I'll test it right now. My reasoning behind the D1 Boss being last is his highest HP and highest damage. Without invulnerabilities, that guy's untouchable...

Xfing

I'm of course asking this question thinking of D1,5, so we would have briefings of existent robots. BTW would it be possible to add briefings for robots unseen in briefings in D1 and 2? Such as the Fusion Hulk, the Red Fatty Jr. and the Super Hulk.

Xfing

With the rotating robots and stuff.

Xfing

That in D1, the final boss actually has 5 gunpoints rather than the obvious 4... he can shoot Megas outta his eye too! Freaky...

Xfing

This level's kicking my ass. BIG TIME. I'm talking about Insane, of course. It's a freaking death trap! Anyone has any idea how to minimize the number of deaths on this level?

Xfing

Ok, let's get back to topic at hand. What boss order do you propose to have in the mission? The lore-wise explanation will be the virus replicating pre-fabricated designs and making enhancements to some of them (D1 boss 1 and 2 need to spawn D2 robots on hit in order for their AI to work properly) L...

Xfing

Sometimes I love using "honestbob" and "almighty" and just running through any mine and constantly spamming shakers. So fun, when I'm whimsical and bored and I don't feel like playing properly. Someone should make a singleplayer mission where you can do that without cheating or ...

Xfing

So you just copy the vertigo ham, rename it to your mission name and put it in your hog file? That sounds... so simple and intuitive, I'm amazed we didn't think of it when we were trying to make this work a year (?) ago. These things are never simple and intuitive. That must have been what slipped ...

Xfing

Well, except Fire and Ice which are immune to energy... I normally don't start using megas "normally" until after level 16 of D2. I might use a couple shakers before level 24 (like in the red key room on level 18, or the start room on level 21 after... stuff... happens) but I mostly save ...

Xfing

It looks like older Vertigo levels that still run have a .HAM file with the same name as the mission, to allow for the Vertigo add-on robots and weapons. I don't know if that's enough to fix the problem, but you could try to see if it works. Otherwise, my backup suggestion is the same as before. Re...

Xfing

Dude, this might be quite handy. Have you already advertised this on the Rebirth forum? Maybe zico will incorporate this officially.

Xfing

Is this going to be playable in Rebirth? Most certainly, I envision this being 100% vanilla oriented. Is there going to be new stuff added? Well, this time I'd rather that there's no new stuff, only the normally available things. I know the D1+D2+Vertigo approach has already been taken in The Lost ...

Xfing

It will be very hard to replicate any of the success of DTWIDD. And any D2 conventions should be ignored in favor of D1 only conventions. Well, the concept is that the mission pack will span both the Solar System, the six systems of D2 and Beta Ceti of Vertigo. There's gonna be no D2 weapons nor ac...

Xfing

It deserves mentioning that the bug only makes itself apparent when you try to turn whole sides. Used with lines, the buttons work fine.

Xfing

Well, no problem. Having 2 bosses is unorthodox. Descent 1,5 is going to be like "Doom the way Id Did", but more of an addon. So the levels shouldn't drastically alter the precepts established in both D1 and 2.

Xfing

D2 is set up so that destroying one boss robot will destroy them all, so you can't really get a "have to kill both". Except (you guessed it) in XL. Or remove the boss flag from one of them. It alters its behavior, though. As for being unable to run Vertigo levels, well... I've already not...

Xfing

Well yeah, that would be quite the idea. I'll try that out sometime, not sure if in this mission, though. That said, I'd also like to include Vertigo robots and bosses, but for some reason custom Vertigo levels are unplayable to me on Rebirth. I wonder why the heck...

Xfing

In identical environment, which boss would pose more danger to the player on Insane? I'm asking because I'm deciding on the bosses' order of appearance in the campaign. D1 final boss has the most HP of them all, at 10,000 it beats any other boss from both the games. Plus, he fires Player Megas in sa...

Xfing

Alter-Fox wrote:In the meantime do it with 7 and 9. They usually give you more control over a curved corridor anyhoo.

You mean like select an edge, 7 it, then select the opposite edge and 9 it? Well yeah, sounds like a plan.

Xfing

1.11.69. Ticket already posted to Sourceforge. Gosh dang it, just when I got quite actively into making levels, this had to pop up. The Editor Toolbar buttons 4 and 6 instead of curving the cube left and right, curve them down and up, same as buttons 2 and 8. Probably a really minor bug, like a sing...

Xfing

True... I didn't take that into consideration. On the other hand, I never go Mega-crazy on bosses in Descent 2. Helix seems to do the job just fine, that cannon's overpowered as hell.

Xfing

Necrobump.

I did it in DTX2. took some work, though, and quite a bit of thinking. The biggest problem were the D1 monitors, in the transition some of them lost some frames. The pog's ready, though.

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