Descent 3 Ship Mod

[Dakatsu]

I am proud to announce that I am starting up my mod again. It didn't really get too far, but thats because of stupidity and time limits (ironically High School allows for more free time than middle school).

Since its been so long and I never got too far, I'll introduce it.

The mods goal is to add many new ships to the game, to make the game more exciting. It isn't a super large mod, but should be fun for a little bit.

Here are the current additional ships:

Code: Select all

-\"Mercenary Pyro\"
   -Graphically a Black Pyro-GL, seen on levels 4 and 15 of the campaign.
   -It is about as fast as a phoenix, or at least has less drag and such.
   -The weapons are majorly overhauled
     -Mass Driver fires two shots instead of one.  Better for MD fights
     -Fires four fusion blobs, and uses 10 energy per fire.
     -Sprays four streams of napalm.
     -Most missiles, excluding the Guided, Mega, Black Shark, and Smart fire in duals.
     -Other TBA changes to weaponry
   -Has very poor shields, can only take half the punishment of a normal Pyro-GL

-\"Starhawk\"
   -Never seen in the game, but was to be added: a fighter for the CED
   -It has less shields than a Phoenix, can take 3/4th of the beating a Pyro-GL can.
   -Many energy weapons fire rapid fire single shots from its central cannon.  If you pick up super lasers, they fire two shots rapid fire.
   -It is faster than a phoenix, but parallels the phoenix in other factors such as turn speed.
   -Although it has little room for larger missiles, such as Megas or Black Sharks, it can hold many small rockets, such as Concussion or Homing Missiles.
   -It can fire two missiles very fast, but then has a longer delay time before firing any other missiles.

I also have overhauled the lasers. Before each ship used Level 2 (Blue) and Level 5 (Yellow) lasers. Now, each ship uses a different set of lasers:

Level 1 (Red - 6 dmg) and Level 6 (White 10.5 dmg)
Level 2 (Blue - 6.75 dmg) and Level 5 (Yellow - 9 dmg)
Level 3 (Purple - 7.75 dmg) and Level 4 (Green - 8.25 dmg)

The laser sets are designed so if you start out with weak lasers, you get very stong lasers: the Level 1 lasers are weak but get boosted 4.5 dmg, while the Level 3 lasers are strong but only get a .5 dmg boost.

Currently, the ships use the following:

Pyro-GL: Blue(2) / Yellow(5)
Phoenix: Red(1) / White(6)
Magnum-AHT: Purple(3) / Green(4)
Black Pyro: Blue(2) / Yellow(5)
Mercenary Pyro: Red(1) / White(6)
Starhawk: Purple(3) / Green(4)
Hood: Purple(3) / Green(4)

Here are the current screenshots, I hope to add logos and team colors to the ships that don't have them later.




I don't know the release, it would be sped up if someone could help me with this:
http://descentbb.net/viewtopic.php?t=13360
I hope to finish code though in a week or two

The bad thing is to play this you can't play on servers not using it while the mod is installed, so I'll host a dedicated server or two for it upon release.

Please tell me your opinions

[Foil]

This is basically a table.gam and ship model alteration, correct? Or are you also doing some work in the D3 SDK?

[TechPro]

So... if I understand you correctly ... the ships will look like they always have, just that the Pyro GL would have Magnum like weaponry and shielding... ? and also move like the brick?

[Dakatsu]

I dont plan to use the SDK currently, but I may if this project grows (I'd have to learn a bit to use it anyway).

I don't exactly get what your talking about TechPro... but here is a brief explanation.

I am introducing new ships, the only thing being changed about the four original ships is that the Magnum has Level 3 and 4 Lasers, and the Phoenix has Level 1 and 6 Lasers.

The Mercenary Pyro, which is a black colored Pyro-GL, is fast and has an overall stronger weapon payload, but has very little shielding (takes twice the amount of damage as a Pyro-GL).

The Starhawk, pictured in my post, fires one laser at a time at twice the firing rate as normal ships. It also carries more lighter missiles (concussion, homing), but less larger missiles (black shark, mega). It has faster speed than the Phoenix, but less armor.

I still don't know what I am going to do for the Hood.

And as stated, the lasers and super lasers are modified so each ship gets different powers of lasers. If you start with level 1, you get level 6 superlasers. If you start at level 2, you get level 5 superlasers (the traditional). If you start out with level 3 lasers, you get level 4 superlasers.

[Spaceboy]

Already tried awhile ago with pyromania, which was actually very good and extensive.

Really, the pheonix, pyro and magnum cover pretty much everything that needs to be covered.

If any ships were to be added, it should probably be an extreme pheonix, or an extreme magnum, and they would only be useful in like a ctf or something.

What would be interesting is if someone made like 5 different models for each the pheonix, pyro and magnum that actually looked good and gained wide acceptance over most servers. It would be kinda like skins, just adding a little more variety. Possibly small changes to each ship like shooting lasers twice as fast, but only one at a time or something.

I probably wouldnt play in a game with ships that shot two md at once that I could kill by sneezing on them.

[Sirius]

For the record, pink/purple was level 2 and blue was level 3 for lasers in D1/2.

[TIGERassault]

Well, good luck!
Unfortunately, I never got the mulitplayer to work for me, so I won't be able to try it out.

[snoopy]

I just say think long and hard about balance before you release. Also, try to make them push people toward highly skilled dogfights, rather than run n gun tactics. That was the problem with subway dancer... it encouraged people to just run in circles spewing secs at anyone nearby without even slowing down.

[Dakatsu]

For the record, pink/purple was level 2 and blue was level 3 for lasers in D1/2.

I knew the lasers weren't correct!

But either way, in Descent 3 they already have in the code "Laser Level 3 - Purple" and "Laser Level 2 - Blue", so I figured I'd use them.

Possibly small changes to each ship like shooting lasers twice as fast, but only one at a time or something.

This is what my Starhawk does, it shoots one at a time, but twice as fast. Gaining quad lasers makes you shoot two at a time twice as fast. (Check the third screenshot, and you can see the lasers are fired one at a time)

I am of course trying to keep balance. The Mercenary Pyro is one that I will need to work hard on for balance. Currently dual MD is on it, but if it is too imbalanced I will balance it out some other way, or remove them.

And Snoopy, I am trying for ships that have a better use of primaries, such as how the Starhawk has the rapid fire one shot at a time primary, and the Hood ship will be an expert at primary weapons.

[Spaceboy]

Does anyone have a model i can use for a black pheonix, and a black magnum?
Oh and, I tried hanging around in your servers but they were really really glitchy for some reason, how often do you reset them?

And, I made two ships to demonstrate what I was talking about, Pm me your e-mail, tell me if you like them or not.
However, in them I didnt count ammo useage or energy usage or anything, just kinda made demonstrations, fire every weapon with both of them, quad and not.

[Dakatsu]

A black phoenix or magnum might be cool, but there isnt one in the game of course.

And as for my servers, I myself get slideshow when I go outside. I really don't know whats wrong myself...

PM coming soon.

[Spaceboy]

Sent.

[Krom]

Actually I would suggest that D3 needs a slight bit of tweaking for the existing ships and weapons instead of completely changing and or adding new ships in. One of the things I would do is try to bring down the dominance of Fusion and the Mass Driver (and secondary weapons) in many levels. But rather than trying to make the Mass Driver and Fusion weaker, I would leave them alone and focus on trying to make the other weapons effective and attractive alternatives.

Mostly what I would do is speed up the travel of most primary weapons such as lasers and plasma, and possibly increase the rate of fire on others for some ships. I would also restore the original unlimited range EMD because it kept things much more interesting in some of the larger levels.

[Spaceboy]

Hmmm, those are actually very good ideas, not hard at all to do either.

I'll post a list of random ideas here-
Making blue lasers as strong as yellow lasers, and making yellow lasers twice as fast.
possibly increase the rate of fire for super lasers by 1.2x

Vauss- increase it's impact force to disorient the victim
Mass driver- reduce the rate of fire
Microwave- Make microwave fire similar to the way it fires in a tank in all ships
Napalm- Increase the range and damage by 1.5-2x
Emd- what krom said, and then possibly reduce the energy usage and up the damage just a little
Plasma-what krom said- plasma speed upped by 1.5x-2x, mabye add an impact force, reduce the damage and increase the rate of fire.
Omega- Reduce the energy usage greatly
Fusion- Decrease the lifetime to the point where it's mostly a shorter range weapon

Homing missile- increase the speed just a bit
Cyclone- increase the lifetime if the separate missiles, increase the damage of the missile before it separates


Does any of this sound appealing at all? Haha.

[Dakatsu]

I do kinda agree... when playing D1/D2, lasers can still shred through everything.

EDIT: Here is something

Descent 2 Damage (Per shot) (Source: Moon's Descendarium)
Laser L1: 10
Laser L2: 11
Laser L3: 12
Laser L4: 13
Laser L5: 24
Laser L6: 25
Plasma: 22 or 11
Fusion: 60 min
Smart Blob: 35 x6

Descent 3 Damage (Per shot) (Source: Table.gam)
Laser L1: 6.75
Laser L2: 7.5 - Laser
Laser L3: 7.75
Laser L4: 8.25
Laser L5: 9 - Super Laser
Laser L6: 10.5
Plasma: 9
Fusion: 12 min
Smart Blob: 20 x 5

SO there was some serious nerfing between Descent 2 and Descent 3

I might consider creating an un-nerfing mod instead...

[Spaceboy]

ships and weapons both also had larger models in the space given, so there was alot more accuracy. Many have already made D2 mods though.

Lasers do need to be alot stronger, and as for tank fusion, mabye it needs to have like a miniblob instead of a third blob.

[Krom]

That would just be nerfing the Fusion and people would hate it. Just because you moth to every random Fusion blob in the level doesn't mean it needs to be weakened.

The problem is Fusion is easier to use effectively than most other weapons, even though in terms of damage per second it loses to a lot of them. You only have to hit once with Fusion for it to get the job done. Just charge it up then get in close and hit hard with it than get out. It takes far less effort and is much safer than getting in close and staying there for a second or more while you work through their shields. Even though the other weapons have the potential to kill someone in two seconds or less, where Fusion will take at least five it is still easier because when you use Fusion you only need to be in the kill zone for an instant and you only have to line up one shot.

What needs to be done is bring the effectiveness and ease of use for the other weapons up to a point where they can properly counter-balance Fusion. Probably the best way to do that is to make them travel a little faster, so you don't have to get as close. This would also make it much more challenging for people using Fusion without actually weakening the weapon. If it is 50% harder to dodge Quad Supers which are quite devastating otherwise than getting in close enough for that one perfect shot can be a real task.

The same also applies to MD: while it can't do the job in one hit, it travels any distance instantly and hits plenty hard enough. You can keep a distance so far away that other weapons are almost completely useless and you will have plenty of time to get those three required shots off. But if other weapons travel faster then they can reach a MD pilot across the field fast enough to keep them moving or else.

[d3jake]

I'd say to add some kind of \"reload time\" between every five MD shots. It would simulate that which is in many ground-pounder games. And since each ammo clip is about 6 rounds(?) Then it would only make sense that every x rounds you need to reload.

[Krom]

That might be possible with masking (BP plasma anyone?) but thats still nerfing a perfectly good weapon.

Think about it in a MD fight in say Veins for instance, if you are fighting someone who only has plasma, do you ever feel uncomfortable in that kind of dogfight? The answer is probably no because plasma travels so slowly that you can see it coming for a long time and easily slide out of its way in that much space. And to compound it even worse; the Phoenix is actually able to fly faster than Plasma, that makes Plasma a pretty green spray of total useless.

[Spaceboy]

That would just be nerfing the Fusion and people would hate it. Just because you moth to every random Fusion blob in the level doesn't mean it needs to be weakened.

The problem is Fusion is easier to use effectively than most other weapons, even though in terms of damage per second it loses to a lot of them. You only have to hit once with Fusion for it to get the job done. Just charge it up then get in close and hit hard with it than get out. It takes far less effort and is much safer than getting in close and staying there for a second or more while you work through their shields. Even though the other weapons have the potential to kill someone in two seconds or less, where Fusion will take at least five it is still easier because when you use Fusion you only need to be in the kill zone for an instant and you only have to line up one shot.

What needs to be done is bring the effectiveness and ease of use for the other weapons up to a point where they can properly counter-balance Fusion. Probably the best way to do that is to make them travel a little faster, so you don't have to get as close. This would also make it much more challenging for people using Fusion without actually weakening the weapon. If it is 50% harder to dodge Quad Supers which are quite devastating otherwise than getting in close enough for that one perfect shot can be a real task.

The same also applies to MD: while it can't do the job in one hit, it travels any distance instantly and hits plenty hard enough. You can keep a distance so far away that other weapons are almost completely useless and you will have plenty of time to get those three required shots off. But if other weapons travel faster then they can reach a MD pilot across the field fast enough to keep them moving or else.

I'm not entirely sure I would like to play in a game where every weapon was as strong as fusion or md. I think fusion and md need to be toned down just a bit, not devastatingly, like making md kill a pyro in 4 hits instead of 3, possibly still kill a pheonix in 3. Fusion actually doesn't seem that overpowered to me, it is supposed to be the 'strongest' weapon afterall as in damage per blob or something. However most other weapons need more strength and effectiveness to make fusion and md not the only weapons in the game, just I've no idea to what extent. Experimentation is the only way to be sure.

[d3jake]

The point would be, for instance, in the center room of Veins, you have Quad SUpers (not bad) and you're in a GL, your enemy has MD, and is in a Phoenix, now odds are that in case you do some really fancy dodgework, that you're going to get hit by some MD rounds while trying to get in closer, so you have better odds of getting your Quads in so they hit the enemy, so every X rounds, have an option to make the person using MD have to be vunerable for some seconds while they have to reload. Perhaps this is my distaste for MD wielding Phoenixs who will play hit and run, which boils down to \"run away, and hit them with a shot every now and then\".

[Spaceboy]

That can be somewhat easily avoided by just firing the 5th shot randomly and running for a bit. It'd have to be a substantial reload time to really change much. I think it can easily be done with masking though, just change the 4th or 5th shot delay to like 10-20 seconds.

[[]V[]essenjah]

I smell a newbie....


Make the MD only have 5 rounds total per-ship, allow it to do 80% damage to the average ship and give it a reload time of 3 seconds. Poof, it is a sniper-rifle, not a blast-o-matic railgun. I once made a custom ship that could fire dual MD's, had a 3 second reload time and could cloak. With some help from Wolf_on_Air that is.


I'm actually working on my own project over time when I feel like it. Replaces all the old ship/weapon models and effects with completely new ones. Stopped working on it a few months back due to simple burn-out and 66+ hour work-weeks as an internet installer. If things ever cool down, I'll probably be on it again as always.

[Money!]

Keep up the work guys. I would definitely be down to play some mods.

[Spaceboy]

Would anyone be interested in testing two modded ships I made? You'd have to know enough to insert them into the main table file, though.